Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 1 of 15
EXHIBIT
........
- - - - - - - - - - --
- --- - - - - - - -- - - - - -- - - - - - - - - - - -Document 833-3 Filed 06/28/2004 Page 2 of 15
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Susan Klein
Page 1
IN THE UNITED STATES COURT OF FEDERAL CLAIMS
YANKEE ATOMIC ELECTRIC COMPANY
(98- 126C)
(Mer ow, S.
CONNECTICUT YANKEE ATOMIC POWER COMPANY
(98- 154C)
(Merow, S.
MAINE YANKEE ATOMIC POWER COMPANY
(98- 474C)
(98- 483C)
(Merow, S.
FLORIDA POWER & LIGHT COMPANY
(Wilson, J.
(Wiese, J.
NORTHERN STATES POWER COMPANY
(98- 484C)
(98- 486C) (98- 488C) (98- 614C)
DUKE POWER, a Division of DUKE ENERGY CORP.
(98- 485C)(Sypolt, J.
(Hodges, J.
(Yock, S.
INDIANA MICHIGAN POWER COMPANY
SACRAMENTO MUNICIPAL UTILITY DISTRICT
SOUTHERN NUCLEAR OPERATING COMPANY, et
(Merow, S.
ale
COMMONWEALTH EDISON COMPANY
( 9 8 - 6 2 1 C) (H ew
it t, J.
BOSTON EDISON COMPANY (99- 447C) (Allegra, J. GPU NUCLEAR, INCORPORATED
(00- 440C)(Bush, J.
WISCONSIN ELECTRIC POWER COMPANY
: VOLUME
(00- 697C)
(00- 703C)
(Merow, S.
POWER AUTHORITY OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK
(Damich, J.
OMAHA PUBLIC POWER DISTRICT
(01- 115C)(Bush, J.
NEBRASKA PUBLIC POWER DISTRICT
(01- 116C)(Sypolt, J.
(OI- 249C)
Discovery
: Judge: : (Judge : Sypol t )
: PAGES
TENNESSEE VALLEY AUTHORITY
(Bruggink, J.
Plalntiffs,
:.;f:f
:1 - 274
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376
- - -- - --
--- - -- - - -- -- -- - - -- -- - --- - -- - - - - - - -Document 833-3 Filed 06/28/2004 Page 3 of 15
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Susan Klein
Page 2
THE UNITED STATES,
Defendant.
Deposition of Susan Klein
Washington, DC
Wednesday, April 24, 2002
Denise Dobner Vickery, RMR, CRR Reported by: 144539 JOB NO.
Esquire Deposition Services
800- 441- 3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 4 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 10
Ms. Klein, are you aware that there I s a
protective order in the spent nuclear fuel
cases?
going
I think there is, yes.
All right.
What I I m going
to do is I I m
to hand you a copy of the protective order and
I I d like
you to take a minute to look at
it.
Okay.
MR. HIRSCH:
Mark that as Exhibit
(Thereupon ,
the reporter marked for
identification Deposition Exhibit No.
THE WITNESS:
(Pause) .
fully understand it at this
point,
Okay. I don but I I ve read
'
through it.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
Okay.
Would you generally agree to abide by
the terms in the protective order, Ms. Klein?
If something is labeled
will keep it confidential.
confidential, yes, I
Okay.
That I s fine. Ms. Klein, I I ve handed you what I s been marked
All right.
as Klein Depos
i tion Exhibit 1 or I I m handing
you that
document, which is the notice of deposition that was
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 5 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 11
issued on April 18th for today s Rule 30(b)(6)
deposition.
those topics?
And if you look on the exhibit
Tha t ' s page
page,
you ll see four topics.
You see
Yes, I see those
topics.
And you understand you re supposed to be the
Rule 30(b)
(6) designated Department of Energy witness
for these four topics?
Yes.
What' s your current position, Ms. Klein?
m a senior policy adviser to the Director and Deputy Director of the Office of Civilian
Radioactive Waste Management at the Department of
Energy.
And how long have you been the senior policy
adviser?
For about three years.
So, since about 1999?
Yes.
I was trans ferred there but detailed
back to general counsel for a couple
;) 1
years.
When was your detail back to General Counsel'
Office?
Esquire Deposition Services
800- 441-3376
-Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM Document 833-3 Filed 06/28/2004 Page 6 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 12
I think it was
' 97 that
I was transferred to
RW, but I was detailed back to general counsel to work
with the general counsel at the time on any legal
issues and then later on it was limited to issues
involving this
litigation.
ll get back to that in a
Okay.
second.
But who do you report to as the senior policy adviser?
Lake Barrett.
Ron Milner and Lake
Barrett.
And Mr. Barrett' s current title
is?
Deputy Director of the Office of Civilian
Radioactive Waste Management.
And Mr. Milner'
s title is?
He' s the COO, the Chief Operating Officer of the Office of Civilian Radioactive Waste Management at
15
16
DOE.
And is the Office of Civilian Radioactive
Waste Management otherwise known by its acronym as
OCRWM?
OCRWM, yes, and actuallr with regard to
Ron, I
think now I just report to Lake.
I was reporting to
Ron when he was also Acting Deputy, but now that
Margaret is here, to just correct the
Esquire Deposition Services
record.
I don
800- 441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 7 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 61
you can answer to your personal
BY MR. HIRSCH:
knowledge.
And what was the acceptance rate in the 1995
ACR report from the DOE?
MS. POWELL:
Same objection.
You can
answer.
THE WITNESS:
Okay.
400 the first
year,
600 the second year, 900 the third year, and then
steady state 900, and that was just through the first
10 years of operation.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
So when the utili ties started submitting DCS
forms, they were relying on whether they had an
allocation in what was then I guess the 1991 ACR; is
that correct?
MS. POWELL:
Obj ection, beyond the
scope.
You can answer.
THE WITNESS:
Yes, I think.
Yeah.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
20 ~
And I take it from your -- strike that?
Referring to the 1995 ACR rates that you just
22 . recited, I take it from your earlier testimony that the
Esquire Deposition Services
800- 441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 8 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 62
D OE is not planning on using those rates in terms of
when it starts accepting spent
nuclear fuel?
No.
Well, once there I s an operational
I don t know if
repository, we are planning to use the larger rates
that were -- that I have mentioned.
we' ll be accepting it outside of a
yet to
repository.
That'
be.
It depends upon your definition of accept
guess.
Do you know when the last time the DOE used
the acceptance rates in the 1995 ACR for planning
purposes?
MS. POWELL:
Object to beyond the
scope.
You can answer to your personal
THE WITNESS:
knowledge.
No, I don
BY MR. HIRSCH:
I -I don' t know.
Let me say, I don t think this one is beyond
the scope because I think it relate to the acceptance
rate question.
Well , I take it from your answer that the DOE
is not currently planning on using the acceptance rates
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 9 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 172
There s a statement there
that:
The NWPA by
its terms contemplated that the entire process of
siting, licensing, and constructing a repository would
have been completed more than four years ago, by
January 31 , 1998.
I do.
You see that statement?
Do you agree that the Nuclear Waste policy Act
contemplated that process of siting, licensing, and
constructing a repository would have been completed by
January 1998?
MS. POWELL:
I object, beyond the scope
and to the extent it calls for a legal
You can answer.
THE WITNESS:
conclusion.
Yes.
m thinking.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
Ms. Klein, will you look at page 40 -- excuse
me -- 19 in the back.
19?
Right.
Last paragraph, first sentence
says:
This is not an insignificant
wait a minute.
m sorry.
Esquire Deposition Services
point" --
Where are you?
Last -800-441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 10 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 196
All right.
general.
Now, let me just ask you in
Is one of the purposes of the total system
life cycle cost reports to determine the total cost of
the Nuclear Waste Disposal Program?
MS. POWELL:
Obj ection.
THE WITNESS:
Yeah.
Beyond the
MS. POWELL:
THE WITNESS:
MS. POWELL:
scope, but -answer.
Yes.
-- you can
BY MR. HIRSCH:
And is one of the reasons that that' s done to
make a determination whether the fees that are being
charged to the utili ties are sufficient?
I think that'
s -Same objection.
MS. POWELL: THE WITNESS:
Go ahead.
I think that' s required by
th& statute that we do that, yes.
MR. HIRSCH:
All right.
Now,
going back
the bullet
points
page
Uh- huh.
Exhibit 16.
Does
this
show a cons truction phase for the
800-441-3376
Esquire Deposition Services
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 11 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 231
BY MR. HIRSCH:
will you look at page 10 of the report or the
testimony, Klein Depos
i tion Exhibit 20.
Do you see at
the very top of that page there' s a statement in
there:
In its August 2001 report on alternative means for
financing and managing the program, DOE stated that unless the program s funding is increased, the budget
might become the
determining factor' whether DOE will
be able to accept wastes in 2010.
Were you aware or are you
aware, Ms. Klein,
scope,
that the DOE has taken that position?
MS. POWELL:
Obj ect to beyond the
but you can
answer.
THE WITNESS:
I worked on that report and
I remember emphasizing how important the budget
is.
don' t remember if we said it was the determining factor
or not, but yes, the budget is a big issue.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
And is it correct that it' s a big issue
because
if the DOE doesn' t get enough money, it can'
21 open the
repository in 2010?
That'
s true.
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 12 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 239
Yeah, I would -- well, it hasn' t been
discussed that I know of that, I' ve known about in a
long time.
The 2007 has not been discus sed,
no.
And does the fact that it' s not been discussed
reflect that it'
No~
s not under consideration?
The new director is looking at all
possibilities, and she' s talking ~~ people about
accelerating.
Are you aware of any current proposal of the
DOE to begin accepting spent nuclear fuel before
Repeat that.
2010?
Do you have obj ection in?
Repeat the beginning of
Let me restate
it. it.
m sorry.
Are you aware of any
proposal by the DOE to begin accepting fuel
earlier than 2010?
No.
Going back to the question I guess I asked you
a little earlier.
Is there a DOE document that you
seen that reflects a range of acceptance dates starting
in 2010 and including -- or strike that?
Have you reviewed a document at DOE which
reflects this range to start removing spent nuclear
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376
-'~
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 13 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 246
MS. POWELL:
m just going to note for
the record that we offered
Mr. Pol log
on I think --
think that you re talking about this topic, but you can
answer.
THE WITNESS:
I don' t remember.
I wasn
told about the backlog.
I was informed that it was
based on 3, 000 was at the time the average utility
discharge rate.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
So...
It was your understanding that the -I don' t know about the backlog issue at
all.
All right.
About that that accounted for a
backlog.
Is it your understanding that the 3, 000 rate
would keep up with the utility discharge rate?
Yes.
that correct?
Uh- huh.
And
then
guess you mentioned the other
m sorry.
reason or rationale.
What was the second
rationale?
70, 000 metr ic tons, which is how much
Esquire Deposition Services
we' re
800-441-3376
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 14 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 247
authorized to put in the first repository, divided by
the life of the repository, which is 25 years.
Gives you about 3, 000
Uh- huh.
metric tons a year?
Given both of those reasons, are you aware of
any reason why the DOE would run the repository at
Yucca Mountain at a rate
MS. POWELL:
less than 3, 000
metric tons?
Obj ect to beyond the
scope,
but you can
answer.
THE WITNESS:
I understand there are lots
of ramp-up
issues.
There'
s transportation issues.
Casks.
I mean,
There' s utility interface issues.
that could af feet
But I know there
it, but that was our planning and
what we d like to do is be able to
1 s
do. that at 3, 000.
lots of things that need to be
worked out.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
Well, assuming that all the ramp-up issues are
resolved including transportation?
Uh- huh.
Are you aware of any reason why the DOE
operate the facility at a 3, 000 metric ton
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376
~-...
Case 1:98-cv-00126-JFM
Document 833-3
Filed 06/28/2004
Page 15 of 15
Susan Klein
Page 248
No, I' m not.
-- over the life of the facility?
No, I'
m not aware of any reason we would not
All right.
little earlier.
You got or we saw this maybe a
In order to
ope!! ~y 2010, does the
DOE need to essentially build a rail line from the
existing rail line in Nevada to the repository?
MS. POWELL:
Obj ection, beyond the
scope,
but you can
answer.
THE WITNESS:
That'
s one of the
possibilities is building a rail
line.
The other is
to have -- I know one of the counties wanted to have
some sort of system through
Lincoln County, Nevada.
there.
I think it'
t made the
To have a transportation truck
centrally located site.
decision yet.
al ternative,
So we haven
Mostly rail is our preferred
but we haven' t decided the routes and the
methods.
BY MR. HIRSCH:
So, well, is there -- is it correct that
Esquire Deposition Services
800-441-3376