Free Response - District Court of Federal Claims - federal

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA
. .....,.

Document 89-2

COpy OF TRANSCRIPT

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 1 of 10

i i i i i i I i ! i I ¡ i

IN THE COURT OF FEDERAL CLAIMS
)

LAVETTA ELK,

I ,

Plaintiff,
vs .

Case No. OS-186L

THE UNITED STATES,

Defendan t.

~." -

)

DEPOSITION OF JOSEPH R. KOPF, taken on behalf of the Plaintiff, pursuant to Agreement of the Parties, beginning at 9:05 a.m. on the 19th day of March, 2007, at the law offices of

Myers, Pottroff & Ball, 320 Sunset Avenue, in the City of Manhattan, County of Riley, and State of Kansas, before Barbara J. Hoskinson, Certified Shorthand

Reporter.
nppin~iggs Repoing ServIC ii
(main Office)
Sil SUI 21st Street
Topeka. HS 66601j
Technology Specialists in Complex litigation

;; DEFENDANT'S EXHIBIT í

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3 z ii

9E

61j20 UJ. 95th Streel Suite 200 j

Toll rree 888.213.3063

Ouerland Park. HS 66212

185.213.3063

rax 185.2130162
www.ßpplnoBlggs.com

913.383JI3

DEFiS95

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 2 of 10

130
1

Q. A. Q.

Is it a very rural road away from
I think so, yeah.

2 the housing?
3

4
5

Were you parked behind a hill?
I d on 't rem e m be r .

A.
rna yb e

I think so,

6

I don't know

7 about it.
8

Try to forget

Q. A.
Q.

Were you far away where
I guess.

from

9 w her e p.e 0 p 1 e c 0 u 1 d h ear you?
10
11

I don't know.

You said that she
Yea h .

Lavetta

12 initiated the sexual contact?
13 14

A.
Q.

'Cause she started by kissing
Started kissing me and

15 you?
16
17

A.
Q.

Where was she kissing you?

18

A.

Neck, lips. Kissed her back, I
, cause f ear

19

guess,
o the r

of,
on c e

o h,

he c k, got no
1 i f t

20
21

option, but
put
my

she

the
on

shirt,
Q.

22

hands, t hat was it, no Did you.allow her to k iss you
in shock.
I me an,

23 24

the

n e c k?

A.

I was

you eve r

25 bee n put i nth a t p 0 sit ion ?
ßppmo
(I 0I)
SUI SW 21Bt

Biggs Reportng Seruice. Inc.
~

Techiiulugy Specldb5ls on Culi/ll"" llllYdllUII

Tope IS 6660
785.273:306

Strt

'IU Fl 88.273.30 Ovd Pak. IS 66212

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Fa 785.273.0762 913.38.1131

DEF2022

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 3 of 10

1

2 the lips?
3

Q.

Did you allow her to kiss you on
Ye a h

131

A.

5 lips?
6 7

4

Q.

Did you kiss her back on the
I don't remember if I did or not.

A.
Q.

How long were the two of you
I don't know.
Ok a y .

8 kissing for?
9

A.
Q.

Few seconds

10

You had your arm on her
my han d

11 or your hand on her breast?
12 13

A.

She

put

on

lifted
breasts

her
and

shirt,
the n
yo u

put
t hat

my

her breast and han d s on her

14
15
16

wa s wh en

it
no, we' 1 1

stopped, 1 ike, do whatever we
Q.

k now, he 1 1

nee d

to

do

17

Did you

did you move your hand

18 around her breast and then caress it?
19

A.
Q.

I don i t remember if I did or not

20

How long did you have your hand

21 0 n her b rea s t ?
Must have been a few seconds. 23 don't k now .
22

A.

I

24

Q.

Was there a period of time when

25 you ' r e h a v i n g t his sex u a 1 con t act wit h
ßppmo
(M 0I)
51 II SW 21st Stt Topeic It 66604

Biggs Reporting Seruice. me.

leclonulogy Specldbsl5 II Cm'~II'K llliYdllU1I
6420 w: 951h Strt, Suile 200

785.23.30

Toll Fl 888.273.3063 Ov Pak. IS 66212

Fa 785.273.0762 913.38,1131

DEF2023

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 4 of 10

1 her where you're reciprocating?
2 3

132

A.
Q.

Reciprocating?
Also, you know, making advances

4 toward her.
5

A.

I don't believe I did.
No.

I was so

.

6
7

in shock what she was pulling.
don i t think so.

No, I

I was just trying

8 to f i gu reo u tho w the he 1 1 tog e t my s elf

9 out of here
10

Q.

Did you immediately remove your

11 hand from her breast or did you keep
12 you r han don the b rea s t for a w h i 1 e ?
13
14 15

A.

I moved my. hand back from her
)

breast
Q. A.

Right away?

16

When that little man started
we need to get out of here

17 k i c kin gin, i twa s 1 ike i we' 1 1 de a 1 wit h
18
19

this, get
Q.

How long were the two of you
I said a few seconds.

20 k iss in g?
21

A.

I don't

22 know.
23

Q.

Was there a period of time where
She tried to pull me, but I guess
ß ppm o. - - ~ Big g S Reporting Seruice. Inc.

24 you w ere p 0 sit ion e don top 0 f her?
25

A.

(M Olce)
5111 SW 21st Strt

Tuciiwlugy Spec'dli"l5 on Coli,,leK i,liYdllUII

Tope It 6660
785.273.30

To Fn 88.23.30 0vPa1S 66212 Pa 785.273.0762 913.3.1131

6420W 95th Strt,

Suie 20

)

DEF2024

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 5 of 10

1

Q.

All right.

168

Did you say you

2 wanted to correct certain things from 3 your prior statements?
4
A

I believe I did

I don't know

5 exactly on the first one, but this one
6
7

is
Q

incompleted) .
After your statement you were

8 also asked some questions under oath by

9 the agent, is that right?
10
11
.71 .

Yes
All right, in this statement you

Q.

12 told the agent that you tried to kiss
13 tried to kiss and touch Lavetta's

breasts. Is that a true statement 15 that a lie that you told?
14 16
17

or is

A.
Q.

Sir, that's what they wrote.

They wrote this statement and you

18 s i g ned it?

19 A . Yea h .
20 Q . Yes?
21

A.

Yea h

They said they wasn't

22 g 0 i n g tot a ken 0 bod Y t 0 j ail, shu t u P

23 and s i g nit
24

Q.

You knew it was a sworn statement

25 t hat you w ere s i g n i n g ?
nppmo
(M 0I)
511 I SW 21st Strl

Big 9 S Reporting Seruice. Inc.

r.dinulugy SpeCldb5ls II CoinpleK llligdLiUtl

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6420 W 95th Strt, Suile 200

To IS 66604 785.273.303

'In Fæe 888.23.306 OvanPai IS 66212

Fa 785.273.0762 913.38.1131

DEF2060

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 6 of 10

1

2 until I signed it.
3

A.

Ye a h .

They didn't let me leave
Did you tell them

169

Q.

All right.

4 that you tried to kiss and touch
5

Lavetta's breasts
t hat.
A.

I'm sorry, strike

6

Did you tell the agent that you
I tried to kiss her?
Ye s .

7 tried to kiss Lavetta?
8 9 10

Q.
A.

Said she tried to kiss me, but

11 they didn't want to hear that.
12

13 tried to touch her breasts?
14 15

Q.

Did you tell the agent that you
Say again, sir.
Did you

A.
Q.

did you tell the agent

16 t hat you t r i edt 0 to u c h L a vet t a's 17 b rea s t s ?
18

A.

Tried to touch Lavetta Elk's
Yeah, did you tell the agent

19 b rea s t s ?
20

21 t hat?
22

Q.

A.

No.
Ok a y

23

Q.

On the statement that you

24 s i g ned 0 n J u n eSt hat i 9 4 5 its a y s t hat 25 L a vet tat 0 1 d you n 0 a t lea s ton c e and
nppmo
(M 0I)
5111 SW 21st Strt
ß i g g S Reporting Seruice. Inc

lecliinilogy Specldlisls '" Cuii~i1eK llligdllUII
6420 W. 95th Strt, Soile 200
'1 Fx 88.273.3 Ovrland

To IS 66604

785.273.30

Pak, ES 66212 Fa 785.273.0762 913.38.1131

DEF2061

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 7 of 10

1 pushed you away at least once.
2
3

170

A.

That's not a true statement

Q.

You lied in this statement under
MR. WEBB:

4 oath?
5

Objection.
Objection.

6 7

BY MR. HOROWITZ:
Q.

You made a false statement?
MR. WEBB:

8
9

A.

Sir, CID wrote this and told me

10 to s i g nit and Ito 0 k my Art i c 1 e 1 5 .
11

BY MR. HOROWITZ:
Q.

12

When you signed this statement
They said sign it or you're goinq

13 did you know it was a false statement?
14

A..

15 to jail, we're not letting yoU leave,

16 and I pre vi 0 U sly sa i dId i d n 't dot his

17 They wouldn't let me leave until I

18 signed it.
19

20 t his?
21

Q.

Who told you that you had to sign

A.
Q.

They did.
Who is they?

22
23

A.

Whoever wrote or signed it, they

24 s aid the y w ere n 't g 0 i n g top u t nob 0 d yin
25 j ail ton i g h tan dIn e e d edt 0 s i g nit and

ßppmo .

Biggs Reportng Service. Ine.

(M 0l) SIll SW 21st Stet
Topeic It 66604

Teinuluyy Spcc'db5L5 in Conq.leK lltlYdlluii

785.273.306

To Fm 88.273.3063 Ovrlan Parle IS 66212

6420 W 95th Stret. Suite 200

Fa785.273.0762 913.38.1131 .

DEF2062

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 8 of 10

1 just go
2 3
Q

171

This was Agent Anthony Tiroch?

A.
Q.

Yes.
Ok a y .

4
5 6

Who else was with him?

A.
Q

I don i t remember.

All right.
Pardon me?

How many people were

7 with you?
8 9
10
A

Just me and him in there.

Q.

A.

All I can remember was just me
On page 2 just above your

11 and him in there.
12

Q.

13 s i g nat u ret her e 's a s tat erne n t t hat say s ,
14 i have made this statement freely

15 without hope of benefit or reward,
16 without threat of punishment, and

17 without coercion, unlawful influence or
18

unlawful inducements.
A.
Q

19

Do you see that? Yes, sir, I see that.

20
21

And you signed right below that?
Yes, sir, I did

A
Q

22

It also says in the statement

23 t hat you k new she did not wan t tom e s s

24 a r 0 u n dan d aft e r she s aid n 0 you s top p e d
25 and rea liz e d w hat you w ere d 0 i n g, soy 0 U
ßppino
(M 0I)
511 1 SW 21st Stret

Biggs Reporting Seruice. Inc

lediiiulogy SpecJdlrsls III Cuiipl~x l'llYdllUll
6420 W. 951h Strt, Suile 200
'Ill Fl 888.273.3063 Ovand

Tope It 66604

785.23.30

IS 66212 Pa Fax 185.273.0762 913.383.1131

DEF2063

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 9 of 10

drove to her friend's house.

172

Is that a

2 true statement?
3
A

No

I'm the one who dropped her
CID did not want to hear that

4 off, told her that's it, I'm dropping
5 6

her off.
I was not

didn't have opportunity of
it also says in

7 counsel as I should have
8

Q.

It says that

9 the s tat e me n t t hat she sa i d now hen you

10 s tar ted k iss i n g .
11

A.

She didn't.

12 in i t i ate d it.
13

She's the one

Q.

Ok a y.

So that was a

14 f a 1 s est ate men tin her e ?
15

that's a

A.
Q.

16
17

Yes, sir. All right
Took my Article is, what else?
It also says that you slipped
Sir, she lifted her shirt.

A.
Q.

18

19 you r han dun de r her s hi r tan d bra.
20
21

A.
Q.
A

So this is a false statement?

22

23

24 w ere n 't g 0 i n g top uta n y bod yin j ail 25 Aft e r pre v i 0 u sly say i n g I did n 't d 0
nppmo
(M 0l) 5111 SW21stStrt
Tope It 66604

Sir, CID told me to sign this They wrote it, I signed it. The y

Biggs Reporting Seriæ Ine

TedlllUlugy Specld1i5ts m CIJlUiill~x llllgdtJUIl

785.273.30

To Fr 88.273.30 Ovd Pa IS 66212

6420 W 9Sth Strt. Suite 200

Fa 785.273.0762 913.38.1131

DEF2064

Case 1:05-cv-00186-FMA

Document 89-2

Filed 09/12/2008

Page 10 of 10

1 this, she initiated it, they did not 2 want to hear this.
3

173

Q.

Did you feel that you were

4 that there was a possibility you were
5

going to be prosecuted after
A.
Q.

when you

6 signed the statement?
7

I already knew it was.
Pardon me?

8 9
10

A.
Q.

Yes.
Hadn't you
hadn't the U.S.

11 attorney's office already declined to

12 prosecute at this point?
13 14

A. Q.

This is military.
Ok a y

So you thought you would

15 b e pros e cut e d b Y who m ?
16

A.
Q.

17

Military. All right

What did you think

18 w 0 u 1 d hap pen toy 0 u ?
19

A.

I didn't know.

They said either

20 s i g nit 0 r we' ret a kin g you t 0 j ail .
21

Q.

All right

You go on to say in

22 t his s tat erne n t t hat you ask e d her i f she
23 had a p lac e t 0 s t a yin K y 1 e, Sou t h 24 Dakota is that true?
25
A.

It's kind of true
ßppmo

I asked her

Big 9 S Reporting Service. hic

(M OIce)
5111 SW 21st

feeliiulogy Svee'dlc;l5 II CoiipleK llllgdllUII

Stri

6420 W. 95th Strl, Suite 200

Toek It 66604

785.23.306

To Fi 88.273.3063 Ovei:and Pa Ir 66212

Fa 785.273.0762 913.383.1131

DEF2065